1 00:00:06,000 --> 00:00:07,680 Are you getting wetter as we sit here? 2 00:00:07,720 --> 00:00:10,560 Well, yeah, because it just keeps coming in over this side. 3 00:00:13,320 --> 00:00:15,960 Yeah. I think we might not be very well inflated. 4 00:00:16,360 --> 00:00:18,080 I am so sorry, ladies. 5 00:00:18,880 --> 00:00:20,000 My pants are wet. 6 00:00:21,400 --> 00:00:23,080 Your pants are very wet. 7 00:00:25,040 --> 00:00:29,680 And that was my first time in Lake Huron in a slowly deflating kayak. 8 00:00:30,120 --> 00:00:33,640 You know that feeling of discovering something new about someone you've loved for 9 00:00:33,640 --> 00:00:36,000 years? Someone who you thought that you knew? 10 00:00:36,000 --> 00:00:39,480 Everything about the places we live can be like that too. 11 00:00:40,600 --> 00:00:42,760 The Great Lakes are imprinted on our identity. 12 00:00:42,800 --> 00:00:44,640 For a lot of us who live in Michigan. 13 00:00:44,880 --> 00:00:47,120 The state touches four of the five Great Lakes, 14 00:00:47,120 --> 00:00:52,160 and many of us have made significant memories in and on and near at least one of the lakes. 15 00:00:52,520 --> 00:00:56,200 But there's still so much to learn about our huge inland seas. 16 00:00:56,480 --> 00:01:02,270 And I remember the first time I came here, I'm flying into Alpena and you are on a 17 00:01:02,270 --> 00:01:04,470 plane, and you can't see the other side of the lake. 18 00:01:04,630 --> 00:01:09,030 And it blew my mind. Like I had no idea the Great Lakes were as big as they are. 19 00:01:09,550 --> 00:01:13,870 I feel like every part of the lakes have like a different identity. 20 00:01:13,910 --> 00:01:16,950 You're listening to Beyond the Shore from Michigan Public. 21 00:01:16,990 --> 00:01:21,550 I'm Rebecca Williams. This is the first of five stories about the Great Lakes. 22 00:01:21,750 --> 00:01:26,790 One story per lake. A snapshot that tells a story about each of the lakes. 23 00:01:26,830 --> 00:01:30,030 A little microcosm of what makes each lake unique. 24 00:01:31,310 --> 00:01:37,750 Chapter one Lake Huron the Great Lakes hold more than 20% of the fresh surface water in 25 00:01:37,750 --> 00:01:41,630 the entire world. If you live here or you've been here, 26 00:01:41,630 --> 00:01:43,110 you've probably gone to the beach. 27 00:01:43,110 --> 00:01:45,670 Maybe you've gone fishing or gotten water up your nose. 28 00:01:45,830 --> 00:01:48,510 But there's so much more to the lakes when you look below. 29 00:01:49,030 --> 00:01:53,350 Like shipwrecks, there are thousands of shipwrecks in the Great Lakes. 30 00:01:53,630 --> 00:01:55,870 I'm sure you've heard of the Edmund Fitzgerald. 31 00:01:55,910 --> 00:02:02,430 That good ship and true was a bone to be chewed when the gales of November came early. 32 00:02:04,350 --> 00:02:08,950 That famous ship went down in a massive storm in Lake Superior in 1975, 33 00:02:08,950 --> 00:02:10,870 killing all 29 men aboard. 34 00:02:11,510 --> 00:02:16,070 Each of the Great Lakes has sunken ships, but in Lake Huron there's a place nicknamed 35 00:02:16,070 --> 00:02:17,230 Shipwreck Alley. 36 00:02:18,030 --> 00:02:20,950 Starting route to Thunder Bay National Marine Sanctuary. 37 00:02:21,110 --> 00:02:25,430 My coworker, Jody Westrick and I took a road trip north from Ann Arbor to check it out. 38 00:02:25,710 --> 00:02:31,070 And now we're going over the river, which looks like it goes out into Lake Huron. 39 00:02:31,270 --> 00:02:33,030 Yep. That's it out there. 40 00:02:33,030 --> 00:02:35,790 It looks like there's a lot of boats out there today or something. 41 00:02:36,310 --> 00:02:41,190 Or maybe those are some of the the, the little moorings where they mark all the 42 00:02:41,190 --> 00:02:41,990 shipwrecks. 43 00:02:42,950 --> 00:02:44,710 The destination is on your left. 44 00:02:44,870 --> 00:02:46,950 Thunder Bay National Marine Sanctuary. 45 00:02:47,390 --> 00:02:48,070 We're here. 46 00:02:48,110 --> 00:02:48,790 Arrived. 47 00:02:50,310 --> 00:02:53,710 Oh my God. Look at all these geese. Don't get too close, 48 00:02:53,710 --> 00:02:54,150 Reb. 49 00:02:55,670 --> 00:02:59,300 We pull into the Sanctuary Museum parking lot in front of a navy blue building, 50 00:02:59,300 --> 00:03:01,180 and we give the geese a lot of space. 51 00:03:01,860 --> 00:03:04,780 If you think of Michigan like the palm of your right hand, 52 00:03:04,820 --> 00:03:08,500 the Thunder Bay National Marine Sanctuary is up at the tip of the pointer finger. 53 00:03:08,900 --> 00:03:13,180 It's the very first freshwater marine sanctuary ever designated in the U.S.. 54 00:03:13,460 --> 00:03:17,580 One of the uniqueness about marine sanctuary is that we protect America's ocean and Great 55 00:03:17,580 --> 00:03:18,460 Lakes treasures. 56 00:03:18,660 --> 00:03:21,100 Jeff Gray is the sanctuary superintendent. 57 00:03:21,100 --> 00:03:24,900 And those treasures are the coral reefs of Florida Keys or the shipwrecks of Thunder 58 00:03:24,900 --> 00:03:26,740 Bay. They're below the waterline. 59 00:03:26,740 --> 00:03:30,100 And when you come to those places, you don't see them automatically. 60 00:03:30,140 --> 00:03:33,780 Ours is hidden. So we need to do a little more work to connect people to them. 61 00:03:34,220 --> 00:03:41,100 The Thunder Bay National Marine Sanctuary is 4300mi² of protected area in the lake full of 62 00:03:41,100 --> 00:03:41,740 shipwrecks. 63 00:03:41,780 --> 00:03:45,340 Through a historical record, we've we've scoured the archives and we've 64 00:03:45,340 --> 00:03:49,420 found historical evidence that about 200 vessels have sank here through archaeology 65 00:03:49,420 --> 00:03:51,220 and science. We're out searching the lake. 66 00:03:51,260 --> 00:03:52,620 We've located about 100. 67 00:03:52,660 --> 00:03:54,700 And there's still about another hundred to find. 68 00:03:55,060 --> 00:03:57,010 On this warm day in late September. 69 00:03:57,050 --> 00:03:59,890 The surface of Lake Huron is so calm and clear, 70 00:04:00,170 --> 00:04:03,370 it's a perfect day to paddle out to see a shipwreck called the Portland. 71 00:04:03,410 --> 00:04:07,850 It's a two masted schooner that sank in a really bad storm in 1877. 72 00:04:08,410 --> 00:04:12,410 To see it, Jodi and I take a ride out to the lake with Sarah Morrison and Sophie Stewart 73 00:04:12,410 --> 00:04:16,610 with the sanctuary. Sophie Parks the big six wheeled truck in the lot at the edge of the 74 00:04:16,610 --> 00:04:17,730 woods near the beach. 75 00:04:18,410 --> 00:04:21,330 All right, we've got life jackets. 76 00:04:21,970 --> 00:04:23,850 We've got air pumps, we've got paddles. 77 00:04:24,210 --> 00:04:25,850 We've got everything for an adventure. 78 00:04:27,290 --> 00:04:28,970 Always prepared for an adventure. 79 00:04:30,850 --> 00:04:34,370 Okay, we are going to blow some more air into this kayak. 80 00:04:39,250 --> 00:04:40,810 What if it deflates while we're out there? 81 00:04:42,530 --> 00:04:45,610 You know, that's why we got the dry bags. 82 00:04:48,210 --> 00:04:49,370 Throw it in, throw it in. 83 00:04:51,930 --> 00:04:54,560 And that is what we call foreshadowing. 84 00:04:55,400 --> 00:04:59,240 Jodi and I grab a handle on either side of the kayak and start down the wooded path to 85 00:04:59,280 --> 00:05:02,280 the beach. I don't want to drag him in the poison ivy. 86 00:05:03,360 --> 00:05:03,840 Or poison. 87 00:05:03,840 --> 00:05:04,840 Ivy. I think so. 88 00:05:04,880 --> 00:05:05,520 Oh, no. 89 00:05:07,520 --> 00:05:13,280 Right now we are dragging an inflatable kayak down to the shore of Lake Huron. 90 00:05:15,320 --> 00:05:16,440 And it's a tandem kayak. 91 00:05:16,440 --> 00:05:18,360 So Jodi and I will be in this together. 92 00:05:18,360 --> 00:05:20,280 So our fates are intertwined. 93 00:05:22,320 --> 00:05:25,640 We have the beautiful, wide, sandy beach almost entirely to 94 00:05:25,640 --> 00:05:30,280 ourselves. I take off my shoes and I roll up my jeans and wade into the shockingly warm 95 00:05:30,280 --> 00:05:32,360 water with Sarah, Jodi, and Sophie. 96 00:05:33,400 --> 00:05:34,640 It's really so shallow. 97 00:05:34,800 --> 00:05:35,160 Yeah. 98 00:05:37,040 --> 00:05:40,480 Yeah. So when when we say you can walk the majority of the way to the shipwreck, 99 00:05:40,480 --> 00:05:49,080 we're not kidding. A lot of the days this is what would happen is a ship would find 100 00:05:49,120 --> 00:05:55,040 shelter in a bay like the Portland and then be driven further inland because of a storm 101 00:05:55,560 --> 00:05:58,320 resulting in wrecking on the rocks. 102 00:05:58,680 --> 00:06:01,120 Even in safe harbor from the storm. 103 00:06:01,480 --> 00:06:03,640 Wow. Okay, so it was really quite dangerous. 104 00:06:03,680 --> 00:06:07,640 Yeah. Oh, yeah. We have lots of salt water captains who talk about. 105 00:06:07,640 --> 00:06:12,160 It's more they've had more dangerous encounters on the Great Lakes than they have 106 00:06:12,160 --> 00:06:13,120 in salt water. 107 00:06:13,240 --> 00:06:13,600 Okay. 108 00:06:13,640 --> 00:06:19,720 Because of wave patterns out here, the waves don't have a lull in between. 109 00:06:20,000 --> 00:06:22,640 So when you've got waves, they're just going to get hit one after 110 00:06:22,640 --> 00:06:23,960 another after another. 111 00:06:24,680 --> 00:06:27,240 So that causes a lot of problems. 112 00:06:27,600 --> 00:06:31,600 And then around here, the limestone reefs that are so shallow. 113 00:06:32,040 --> 00:06:35,880 Sophie says this area includes the main shipping channel for ships to move between 114 00:06:35,880 --> 00:06:38,000 the lower lakes and the upper lakes. 115 00:06:38,040 --> 00:06:40,600 They would have to go past Thunder Bay. 116 00:06:40,960 --> 00:06:43,720 So it's kind of the natural turning point in Lake Huron. 117 00:06:43,760 --> 00:06:46,240 You've got hundreds of ships going back and forth. 118 00:06:46,800 --> 00:06:48,760 Collisions were a very common thing. 119 00:06:48,760 --> 00:06:50,520 And good weather or poor weather. 120 00:06:50,720 --> 00:06:54,990 Our storms come up very aggressively, as does our fog. 121 00:06:55,270 --> 00:06:59,710 And Lake Huron Can has reported waves up to 30ft high. 122 00:06:59,990 --> 00:07:02,430 Jodi and I get into the kayak really carefully. 123 00:07:02,430 --> 00:07:06,870 We don't want to get our expensive equipment wet, but then just a few minutes after we've 124 00:07:06,870 --> 00:07:09,510 left the beach, everything goes sideways. 125 00:07:09,750 --> 00:07:11,350 Are you getting wetter as we sit here? 126 00:07:11,470 --> 00:07:14,270 Well, yeah, because it just keeps coming in over this side. 127 00:07:17,110 --> 00:07:19,750 Yeah. I think we might not be very well inflated. 128 00:07:20,150 --> 00:07:21,830 I am so sorry, ladies. 129 00:07:22,670 --> 00:07:23,830 My pants are wet. 130 00:07:25,190 --> 00:07:26,830 Your pants are very wet. 131 00:07:29,070 --> 00:07:31,110 Jodi jumps out soaking wet. 132 00:07:31,110 --> 00:07:36,350 So it's on to plan B. Jodi stays on shore and I climb onto Sarah's paddle board and sit 133 00:07:36,350 --> 00:07:39,190 cross-legged on the front while she paddles us out into the lake. 134 00:07:41,390 --> 00:07:42,750 Oh, look at that, sunshine. 135 00:07:43,030 --> 00:07:43,910 Oh, it's so beautiful. 136 00:07:43,910 --> 00:07:46,830 Now I feel like I should be singing to Rebecca. 137 00:07:47,030 --> 00:07:47,550 Like. 138 00:07:48,070 --> 00:07:49,390 Like we're in a gondola, right? 139 00:07:51,380 --> 00:07:53,900 Okay, so now you can see the clear water. 140 00:07:53,900 --> 00:07:55,740 Tons of rocks. 141 00:07:55,940 --> 00:07:57,820 It's so clear. We can see right to the bottom. 142 00:07:57,980 --> 00:08:00,620 Yeah. And the boy is right in front of us. 143 00:08:00,940 --> 00:08:05,780 And these boys not only make it easier to find the shipwreck so you can explore them, 144 00:08:06,300 --> 00:08:10,340 but also you're going to see, like, a yellow tow line on the buoys where 145 00:08:10,340 --> 00:08:14,020 you can easily anchor whether you have a boat or, 146 00:08:14,580 --> 00:08:19,460 you know, a lot of paddle boards and kayaks have those bungee cords you can tie directly 147 00:08:19,460 --> 00:08:25,380 up to it. The Portland is a schooner or former schooner, 148 00:08:25,380 --> 00:08:32,540 I should say. And there was a very bad storm October kind of late 1800s. 149 00:08:32,740 --> 00:08:37,620 And that storm pushed the boat closer and closer to shore so that the rocks actually 150 00:08:37,620 --> 00:08:40,940 did start to tear holes in it, leading to it sinking. 151 00:08:41,420 --> 00:08:43,500 So thankfully, the crew was able to survive. 152 00:08:43,500 --> 00:08:47,420 So often when you're close to shore like that, that is the benefit of being washed 153 00:08:47,420 --> 00:08:55,490 ashore in a storm, but we're getting closer, so hopefully we'll be seeing something in 154 00:08:55,490 --> 00:09:00,290 just a moment. I think it might actually be in. 155 00:09:00,970 --> 00:09:02,450 Oh, there's part of it. 156 00:09:02,770 --> 00:09:06,690 Oh, yeah. Oh, that's so cool. 157 00:09:06,890 --> 00:09:08,690 Oh my gosh. Okay. 158 00:09:09,570 --> 00:09:11,570 Oh, we're literally just directly gets old. 159 00:09:11,570 --> 00:09:14,130 Like I'm looking out in front of you. Rebecca. Do you see that? 160 00:09:14,170 --> 00:09:18,530 Yeah. That's amazing. The thick wooden beams of the Portland emerge below us, 161 00:09:18,530 --> 00:09:20,930 looking like railroad tracks under the water. 162 00:09:20,930 --> 00:09:22,530 And so imagine snorkeling this. 163 00:09:23,410 --> 00:09:26,250 You definitely you know, we always say, please don't touch, 164 00:09:26,250 --> 00:09:29,770 but you can get very, very close to this wreck. 165 00:09:29,810 --> 00:09:33,330 And this is one of the things about Lake Huron with shipwrecks, right? As well that 166 00:09:33,330 --> 00:09:36,530 you have some shallow shipwrecks close to shore. 167 00:09:36,730 --> 00:09:39,610 Yeah. You know, probably in all the Great Lakes we have that. 168 00:09:39,610 --> 00:09:43,690 But you know, us being a marine sanctuary, we highlight our shipwrecks a bit more than 169 00:09:43,690 --> 00:09:45,690 maybe other parts of the Great Lakes. 170 00:09:46,530 --> 00:09:49,080 Where maybe it's more of a word of mouth or, you know, 171 00:09:49,120 --> 00:09:52,880 because there are shipwrecks all over the Great Lakes, but here it is easier to 172 00:09:52,920 --> 00:09:54,680 recreate on them like this. 173 00:09:55,280 --> 00:09:57,920 Look at this. We're just sailing over these huge beams. 174 00:10:00,440 --> 00:10:02,000 Sarah paddles us back to shore. 175 00:10:02,200 --> 00:10:06,240 I get back to the beach and I find Jodi safely on land and drying out. 176 00:10:06,600 --> 00:10:09,400 She told me before that this is her favorite lake. 177 00:10:09,640 --> 00:10:13,280 Every time I come here, I'm always surprised about how clear the 178 00:10:13,280 --> 00:10:15,680 water is, and it just is so. 179 00:10:16,240 --> 00:10:19,960 Well, today it's very calm and peaceful, and I think most of the time when I've been 180 00:10:19,960 --> 00:10:21,160 here, it's been that way. 181 00:10:21,920 --> 00:10:29,800 And it just feels so soothing sitting here listening to the waves come in and looking at 182 00:10:29,800 --> 00:10:31,200 how beautiful it all is. 183 00:10:33,400 --> 00:10:36,360 For her. Like a lot of us, the experience of being at your favorite 184 00:10:36,360 --> 00:10:40,600 great lake. It's not just the lake itself, it's your memories of all the times that 185 00:10:40,600 --> 00:10:41,880 you've spent at the lake before. 186 00:10:43,040 --> 00:10:48,160 Every summer, for as long as I can remember, we would come up with our little pop up 187 00:10:48,160 --> 00:10:51,280 camper and we'd camp at Tawas Point State Park. 188 00:10:51,320 --> 00:10:56,600 I just remember spending days and days and days playing on the beach with my cousins, 189 00:10:56,600 --> 00:11:00,320 laying on the water, screaming like songs we learned in Girl Scouts, 190 00:11:00,600 --> 00:11:02,400 and just having the time of my life. 191 00:11:02,400 --> 00:11:04,240 And those are some of my favorite memories. 192 00:11:06,360 --> 00:11:10,120 And as Sophie Stewart explains, the Great Lakes are especially good at 193 00:11:10,120 --> 00:11:12,560 preserving memories in the form of history. 194 00:11:13,000 --> 00:11:15,920 Lake Huron, obviously is our favorite because of the sanctuary, 195 00:11:15,920 --> 00:11:19,200 but all five of the Great Lakes, the cold, fresh, 196 00:11:19,400 --> 00:11:22,840 deep water is what is preserving those wrecks. 197 00:11:23,080 --> 00:11:26,760 So if you take a wooden shipwreck and sink it in the Atlantic Ocean, 198 00:11:26,800 --> 00:11:29,240 say you're looking at a ship from the 1800s. 199 00:11:29,520 --> 00:11:34,360 There are different microorganisms and creatures in warm, 200 00:11:34,360 --> 00:11:39,720 salty water that will eat wood and deteriorate those shipwrecks a lot faster. 201 00:11:39,880 --> 00:11:42,840 Specifically teredo worms and other things like that. 202 00:11:43,120 --> 00:11:49,190 So we get shipwrecks off the Atlantic coast, where all that's left is the iron fastenings 203 00:11:49,190 --> 00:11:51,190 or cannons or cannonballs or things like that, 204 00:11:51,190 --> 00:11:53,830 because all of the wood has literally been eaten away. 205 00:11:54,230 --> 00:12:00,150 Whereas here those microorganisms and creatures can't survive in cold, 206 00:12:00,150 --> 00:12:00,950 fresh water. 207 00:12:00,990 --> 00:12:04,630 That means these Great Lakes shipwrecks are much more intact. 208 00:12:04,830 --> 00:12:09,430 One that's really famous in Lake Michigan is the Rouse Simmons or the Christmas tree ship. 209 00:12:10,030 --> 00:12:12,990 And that one would carry cargoes of Christmas trees from the U.P. 210 00:12:13,030 --> 00:12:18,150 down to Chicago. And that wreck still has the trunks of the Christmas trees of the last 211 00:12:18,150 --> 00:12:19,350 cargo on board. 212 00:12:22,110 --> 00:12:25,790 Sometimes artifacts disappear from shipwrecks in Lake Huron. 213 00:12:26,030 --> 00:12:29,270 We'll hear where they often end up after this quick break. 214 00:12:37,590 --> 00:12:38,910 This is beyond the shore. 215 00:12:38,950 --> 00:12:43,940 I'm Rebecca Williams. Scuba divers come to Lake Huron from all over to check out these 216 00:12:43,940 --> 00:12:47,620 shipwrecks. And so do maritime archaeologists. 217 00:12:47,900 --> 00:12:52,420 That job is just what it sounds like someone who studies archaeology underwater. 218 00:12:52,460 --> 00:12:57,580 Thunder Bay is really known for having exceptional levels of preservation on its 219 00:12:57,580 --> 00:13:01,580 shipwrecks, so any underwater archaeologist is always excited about coming up to the 220 00:13:01,580 --> 00:13:04,420 Great Lakes. So when the position came available, 221 00:13:04,420 --> 00:13:07,260 I was I jumped on it even though I'd never been to Michigan before. 222 00:13:07,340 --> 00:13:10,220 So my name is Andy Yoxtheimer. 223 00:13:10,220 --> 00:13:14,580 I'm a resource protection specialist at Thunder Bay National Marine Sanctuary. So I'm 224 00:13:14,580 --> 00:13:19,300 from Reno, Nevada. So I grew up close to Lake Tahoe and I thought Lake Tahoe was a big 225 00:13:19,300 --> 00:13:23,220 lake. And I remember the first time I came here, 226 00:13:23,220 --> 00:13:28,220 I flying into Alpena and you are on a plane and you can't see the other side of the lake. 227 00:13:28,380 --> 00:13:32,380 And it blew my mind. Like, I had no idea the Great Lakes were as big as 228 00:13:32,380 --> 00:13:38,020 they are. It's also really cool interacting with the Great Lakes and the people here. 229 00:13:38,020 --> 00:13:41,860 They have such a strong connection to the water and connection to the lake. 230 00:13:42,460 --> 00:13:46,900 Whichever lake they're on, I feel like every part of the lakes have, 231 00:13:46,940 --> 00:13:48,140 like a different identity. 232 00:13:48,900 --> 00:13:51,300 Lake Huron is definitely it feels a little bit more. 233 00:13:51,420 --> 00:13:54,420 It feels a little quieter, a little bit more wild. 234 00:13:54,540 --> 00:13:58,180 We're meeting up with Andy on a research boat that's tied to a dock at the Marina. 235 00:13:58,220 --> 00:14:01,180 Early the next morning, she's about to go do something called 236 00:14:01,180 --> 00:14:02,780 multibeam mapping. 237 00:14:03,060 --> 00:14:05,980 And what it does is it sends sound down into the water column. 238 00:14:05,980 --> 00:14:10,420 And then basically like echolocation, how long it takes for that sound to reach our 239 00:14:10,420 --> 00:14:13,300 boat again. That'll tell us water depth. 240 00:14:13,300 --> 00:14:17,100 And we use that to get really high definition maps of the sanctuary. 241 00:14:17,340 --> 00:14:19,380 We protect submerged cultural resources. 242 00:14:19,380 --> 00:14:22,900 So we're always looking for more shipwrecks. So that's something that we're always keeping 243 00:14:22,900 --> 00:14:24,900 an eye out for on the maps as well. 244 00:14:25,460 --> 00:14:29,180 Andy says a lot of shipwrecks they haven't found yet are probably in the deeper waters 245 00:14:29,180 --> 00:14:33,340 of the bay. She says even though shipwrecks have a better shot at surviving in the Great 246 00:14:33,340 --> 00:14:35,420 Lakes, there are some challenges. 247 00:14:35,540 --> 00:14:39,060 Ice can be a large issue for our really shallow shipwrecks. 248 00:14:39,540 --> 00:14:44,890 We call it fillet of schooner because all of our shallow shipwrecks are quite broken down. 249 00:14:44,930 --> 00:14:48,130 Also, we deal a lot with zebra and quagga mussels. 250 00:14:48,490 --> 00:14:51,490 Those have become a huge issue in the Great Lakes. 251 00:14:51,690 --> 00:14:54,330 Most of our shipwrecks have are covered in mussels. 252 00:14:54,330 --> 00:14:58,490 But then another factor that we're always looking at is the human interaction with 253 00:14:58,490 --> 00:15:01,090 shipwrecks. We want people to dive them. 254 00:15:01,090 --> 00:15:03,050 We want people to be on these shipwrecks. 255 00:15:03,050 --> 00:15:04,130 We want them to see them. 256 00:15:04,130 --> 00:15:07,850 So we really feel that like until you can see something, 257 00:15:08,010 --> 00:15:11,330 you're not going to want to protect it. So we want people to interact with these sites. We 258 00:15:11,330 --> 00:15:13,850 want them to have a personal connection. 259 00:15:13,890 --> 00:15:16,250 Of course, the flip side of that is, you know, 260 00:15:16,290 --> 00:15:19,170 the more people you're allowing onto sites, unfortunately, 261 00:15:19,170 --> 00:15:22,890 the more likely it is that some artifacts are going to disappear. 262 00:15:23,490 --> 00:15:25,290 How can you get the artifacts back? 263 00:15:25,650 --> 00:15:29,930 Unfortunately, a lot of times they end up on like Facebook Marketplace or Craigslist. 264 00:15:30,250 --> 00:15:34,810 So I know recently some of our the timbers from one of our shipwrecks were recently 265 00:15:34,810 --> 00:15:38,050 recovered because someone had tried to sell them on Facebook Marketplace. 266 00:15:38,680 --> 00:15:42,600 So yeah, it's a constant struggle trying to find these artifacts again. 267 00:15:42,840 --> 00:15:45,360 And unfortunately, a lot of them are not recovered. 268 00:15:47,520 --> 00:15:51,360 The team at Thunder Bay is also collecting water samples that they send to Reagan 269 00:15:51,360 --> 00:15:55,000 Herrera. She's a research ecologist at the Great Lakes Environmental Research 270 00:15:55,000 --> 00:15:59,480 Laboratory. We lovingly call the instrument Richard. 271 00:15:59,680 --> 00:16:04,240 Just to make it easy and fun within the lab when we're doing our measurements, 272 00:16:04,560 --> 00:16:07,480 because short wise, it's DIC. 273 00:16:07,960 --> 00:16:09,880 Because it's dissolved inorganic carbon. 274 00:16:09,920 --> 00:16:13,880 Yep. Got it. Exactly. So that's why we were like, 275 00:16:13,880 --> 00:16:15,840 we can't really put that right. 276 00:16:15,880 --> 00:16:17,680 That acronym might not be great. 277 00:16:18,320 --> 00:16:19,840 So let's call him Richard. 278 00:16:21,120 --> 00:16:25,760 Reagan and her team are using Richard to study freshwater acidification in Lake Huron. 279 00:16:25,960 --> 00:16:28,120 It's a process related to our changing climate, 280 00:16:28,120 --> 00:16:31,280 and it's something that scientists think might affect the shipwrecks. 281 00:16:31,320 --> 00:16:32,640 Within the atmosphere. 282 00:16:32,880 --> 00:16:39,070 Co2 in particular is increasing and that increase has to go somewhere. 283 00:16:39,070 --> 00:16:43,190 I can stay in the atmosphere, or it can go into different bodies of water 284 00:16:43,190 --> 00:16:44,630 that become a sink for it. 285 00:16:44,670 --> 00:16:49,270 You've probably heard of things like corals having issues creating their backbone 286 00:16:49,270 --> 00:16:52,230 structure because of the acidification we're seeing in the oceans. 287 00:16:52,350 --> 00:16:56,310 Well, freshwater also the same equation applies. 288 00:16:56,510 --> 00:16:59,510 She says there's not a lot of research yet about what's happening with freshwater 289 00:16:59,510 --> 00:17:03,310 acidification in Lake Huron and how that might affect the shipwrecks. 290 00:17:03,310 --> 00:17:09,070 We don't really know how that might then lead to potential stress or deterioration of those 291 00:17:09,070 --> 00:17:13,150 heritage sites. On top of that, there's not a lot of work or research looking 292 00:17:13,150 --> 00:17:19,950 into how acidification could impact wood or metal structures that have been underwater. 293 00:17:20,030 --> 00:17:24,030 One of the great reasons we have these wonderful sites is because it's cold and it's 294 00:17:24,030 --> 00:17:25,950 stable where they're located. 295 00:17:26,470 --> 00:17:30,350 But if those environmental conditions start to change, 296 00:17:30,350 --> 00:17:32,510 it could also change how they're preserved. 297 00:17:40,260 --> 00:17:44,140 So what I do is I read the tilt of the buoy, and it tells me which way the wind will blow 298 00:17:44,140 --> 00:17:45,420 the boat over the wreck. 299 00:17:45,820 --> 00:17:48,700 Okay. So, J-Roc. Okay. 300 00:17:48,700 --> 00:17:49,180 Right here. 301 00:17:49,740 --> 00:17:52,420 Yes, sir. Yeah, I'm gonna go. 302 00:17:52,460 --> 00:17:54,900 I'm gonna go around and then come back. 303 00:17:55,060 --> 00:17:56,540 Okay. I'm gonna go starboard. 304 00:17:56,900 --> 00:17:59,540 Yeah. All right. It's gonna be starboard. 305 00:17:59,980 --> 00:18:04,020 Starboard grip. I'm going to go low and go around and then come back and get blown onto 306 00:18:04,020 --> 00:18:05,820 it. Roger. 307 00:18:06,580 --> 00:18:10,740 That's captain Matt Southwell with his deckhand and friend John Lacrosse, 308 00:18:10,860 --> 00:18:12,580 who goes by the nickname J-Roc. 309 00:18:13,020 --> 00:18:15,260 Captain Matt is at the helm of the Lady Michigan. 310 00:18:15,260 --> 00:18:18,700 It's a glass bottomed boat that visits some of the shipwrecks a little farther out from 311 00:18:18,700 --> 00:18:21,780 shore. Jody and I joined him for a tour before we head home. 312 00:18:22,100 --> 00:18:23,460 My name is Captain Matt. 313 00:18:23,500 --> 00:18:24,860 I am your captain today. 314 00:18:24,900 --> 00:18:26,460 Captain Matt grew up up here. 315 00:18:26,500 --> 00:18:29,620 I've been diving these wrecks since I was a kid, so I've always been in love with the 316 00:18:29,620 --> 00:18:31,980 wrecks and our shipwreck history. 317 00:18:32,020 --> 00:18:35,820 He says he started diving on a wreck called the Shamrock outside his aunt and uncle's 318 00:18:35,820 --> 00:18:37,420 house when he was nine. 319 00:18:37,420 --> 00:18:39,940 And then when we hit it, it was like, oh, what is that in front of me? 320 00:18:39,980 --> 00:18:41,700 You know, it spooked, it spooks you. 321 00:18:41,740 --> 00:18:46,420 It really does. The first time when you're I don't know if it does that to everybody, 322 00:18:46,420 --> 00:18:49,220 but it kind of creeps you out because it used to be a living, 323 00:18:49,620 --> 00:18:53,180 working vessel, you know, and you automatically think people died on 324 00:18:53,180 --> 00:18:55,300 this even though no one died on that wreck at all. 325 00:18:56,020 --> 00:18:58,980 But before he was a captain, he went to Hollywood. 326 00:18:59,140 --> 00:19:01,820 Back at my old life, I lived in Hollywood. 327 00:19:01,860 --> 00:19:02,900 Yeah. And I was an actor. 328 00:19:02,900 --> 00:19:04,460 I was in a couple of TV shows. 329 00:19:05,100 --> 00:19:08,100 There's only three reasons a person gets rid of a vehicle. One, 330 00:19:08,100 --> 00:19:11,740 they sell it. Two, they ruin it in order to bilk the insurance company, 331 00:19:12,260 --> 00:19:15,180 or three, they destroy it to hide something. 332 00:19:16,980 --> 00:19:18,740 What do you think my son is trying to hide? 333 00:19:21,140 --> 00:19:22,380 I better find that jeep, Mr. 334 00:19:22,380 --> 00:19:22,820 Evans. 335 00:19:23,860 --> 00:19:28,900 And really, when I left the music business and the acting profession and moved back from 336 00:19:28,900 --> 00:19:34,090 Hollywood to here. I knew I had to do something that had the same amount of passion 337 00:19:34,090 --> 00:19:40,290 that I had for that stuff in the arts and the lake and the wrecks is definitely where my 338 00:19:40,290 --> 00:19:44,370 passion lies. And this job was the corridor toward that. 339 00:19:44,370 --> 00:19:47,730 But he says being a captain is still a dangerous job. 340 00:19:48,210 --> 00:19:51,610 Being a captain on the Great Lakes is you have to respect them. 341 00:19:51,610 --> 00:19:59,450 You have to understand that these are inland seas and can turn ordinary real quick. 342 00:19:59,930 --> 00:20:03,290 There's a reason there's wrecks out here. These lakes have to be respected. 343 00:20:03,290 --> 00:20:04,730 They're extremely dangerous. 344 00:20:04,890 --> 00:20:08,050 When I worked in the Arctic, the thing that shocked me the most was some 345 00:20:08,050 --> 00:20:10,170 of these preeminent oceanographers. 346 00:20:11,050 --> 00:20:13,690 Like what? They get 20 foot waves on the Great Lakes. 347 00:20:13,690 --> 00:20:16,170 I'm like, are you out of your mind? I got two words for you, 348 00:20:16,210 --> 00:20:17,730 Edmund Fitzgerald. Man. 349 00:20:17,770 --> 00:20:20,450 Out here, the weather can change the drop of a hat. 350 00:20:20,890 --> 00:20:24,770 Even mild weather affects how Captain Matt guides the Lady Michigan on tours. 351 00:20:25,010 --> 00:20:29,010 He and his crew have to monitor slight wind and wave changes to make sure the passengers 352 00:20:29,010 --> 00:20:32,400 will be able to see the wrecks through the boat's transparent bottom. 353 00:20:32,400 --> 00:20:34,680 The wrecks and learn. The history is, I think, 354 00:20:34,680 --> 00:20:37,720 huge to people because it lets them know where they came from. And if you don't know 355 00:20:37,720 --> 00:20:40,240 where you came from, how do you know where you're going? 356 00:20:41,520 --> 00:20:44,760 Give yourself a pat on the back because you just survived Shipwreck Alley. 357 00:20:46,240 --> 00:20:47,040 Thank goodness. 358 00:20:50,520 --> 00:20:53,920 There are still about a hundred shipwrecks that remain hidden in the depths here in 359 00:20:53,920 --> 00:20:55,520 Shipwreck Alley in Thunder Bay. 360 00:20:55,800 --> 00:21:00,240 Despite all the explorers, researchers, and even former Hollywood actors 361 00:21:00,240 --> 00:21:03,720 who spend their days devoted to their preservation and discovery, 362 00:21:04,240 --> 00:21:08,000 in a lot of ways, the Great Lakes really are like our loved ones who remain partial 363 00:21:08,000 --> 00:21:12,280 mysteries to us. To know them better, to understand their pasts. 364 00:21:12,520 --> 00:21:15,000 We just have to stay close and keep digging. 365 00:21:19,680 --> 00:21:23,760 Next time on Beyond the Shore, Michigan Public's Dustin Dwyer takes us 366 00:21:23,760 --> 00:21:25,720 surfing on Lake Michigan. 367 00:21:25,760 --> 00:21:27,200 It was mostly surfer in Florida. 368 00:21:27,200 --> 00:21:30,920 And you came up here. And what did you think when people first mentioned that you could 369 00:21:30,920 --> 00:21:31,680 surf out here. 370 00:21:31,720 --> 00:21:34,720 I thought they were kind of stupid, honestly. It looked it looked really bad, and 371 00:21:34,720 --> 00:21:38,080 I thought, no way they're having fun out there. But they definitely are. 372 00:21:38,080 --> 00:21:42,400 So we'll hear why surfers are especially drawn to Lake Michigan. 373 00:21:50,200 --> 00:21:53,000 Jodi Westrick and I reported and produced this episode. 374 00:21:53,240 --> 00:21:55,160 Vincent Duffy was our main editor. 375 00:21:55,360 --> 00:21:58,400 Dustin Dwyer and Jodi Westrick also contributed edits. 376 00:21:58,720 --> 00:22:01,640 Special thanks to Meredith Leoniak and Randy cast. 377 00:22:01,920 --> 00:22:05,400 Support for the production of this podcast was made possible by the Charles Stewart Mott 378 00:22:05,400 --> 00:22:08,080 Foundation as part of its Great Lakes News Collaborative. 379 00:22:08,440 --> 00:22:10,360 Music by blue Dot sessions. 380 00:22:10,880 --> 00:22:14,960 I'm Rebecca Williams. Beyond the shore is a production of Michigan Public. 381 00:22:15,120 --> 00:22:18,720 You can find all of our podcasts at Michigan public.org slash.