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Jane: This is But Why: A Podcast
for Curious Kids from Vermont

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Public. I'm Jane Lindholm. On
this show, we take questions

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from curious kids just like you,
and we find answers. Today we're

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talking about a very special
family relationship, potentially

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one of the longest relationships
some of you will ever have in

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your lifetime: the sibling
relationship. That's right,

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today we're talking about
brothers and sisters and all the

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different kinds of siblings you
might have. Love them or hate

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them, they can be an integral
part of your early life and

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shape who you become. Not
everyone has a sibling, and

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that's great! But in the United
States, 80% of people have at

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least one, and while there's a
lot of focus on the influence

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parents have on who we become,
studies suggest siblings can

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have even more of an impact on
our development. But before we

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dig into that, first a very
important question.

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Taylor: Hi, I'm Taylor, and I'm
five, from Melbourne, and how do

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brothers and sisters turn to
brothers and sisters?

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Jane: Your brothers and sisters
are your siblings. And siblings

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are children in the same family
who share at least one parent.

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So you get your siblings when
your parent or parents decide to

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add you or another child to the
family. Sometimes that's through

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birth or adoption. You can also
have siblings that you only

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share one parent with. Sometimes
people call this a half-sibling,

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which is kind of funny, because
they're definitely a full

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person. And you can get
stepsiblings if one of your

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parents marries someone who
already has kids. Some families

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care for kids temporarily
through foster care or other

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arrangements. And those kids can
also be your siblings, even if

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they only live with you for a
short time. There are a lot of

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different kinds of families, and
so there are actually a lot of

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ways to get a sibling. Research
shows, though, whether your

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sibling is your step, half, or
full sibling, they can still

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have an impact on your
development. Interestingly

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enough, most studies of sibling
relationships don't even

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differentiate between the kinds
of siblings.

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Charlotte: I'm Charlotte, and
I'm five years old. I live in

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London, Ontario, Canada, and my
question is, why do brothers and

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sisters look a lot alike?

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Jane: Sometimes siblings look a
lot alike, and sometimes they

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don't look alike at all!
Sometimes you look alike because

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you share genetic material with
your siblings. You get half your

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genes from a male biological
parent and half from a female,

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but the genes you get are
randomly assigned, so siblings

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can get different combinations,
and some traits are more

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heritable--more easily passed
down--than others. There are

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also environmental influences,
both in your genetics and in how

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you choose to look. Maybe you
and your siblings dress

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similarly or make the same
facial expressions or say the

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same kind of things because you
live together. So your

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similarities are not just
genetic. And sometimes we try

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our absolute hardest to look and
behave nothing like our

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siblings! So you and your
siblings might look a lot alike,

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or you might look very
different, whether you share DNA

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or not.

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When I was a kid, people used to
see me out with my stepfather,

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and they'd sometimes stop us and
tell us how much we looked

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alike. We always smiled and said
thank you. But then we kind of

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giggled a little bit afterwards,
because we aren't biologically

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related at all. But we did spend
a lot of time together when I

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was a kid, so it kind of makes
sense that we would look alike.

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And your genetics certainly
don't define how you feel about

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your family or how much they
love you. Beyond the story of

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how you got your siblings or
whether or not you look alike,

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your siblings can have a big
impact on who you become. One

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author we know has spent a lot
of time thinking about and

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researching why that is. So we
called her up to talk a little

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bit about what she's learned.
Susan Dominus writes for The New

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York Times Magazine, and one of
her books is called The Family

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Dynamic.

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Susan Dominus: I actually
started off thinking about how

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to write a book about how
parents help their kids dream

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big and go about achieving those
dreams. I was really interested

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in parents who encouraged their
kids to think they could change

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the world. When I started
reporting the book, what I was

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hearing from these, you know,
incredible siblings from

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families like this, although
they talked about their parents,

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they also talked about the way
their siblings helped them get

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to the point that they were
trying to reach. And I realized

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that that was kind of an
underappreciated piece of the

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puzzle in general, when people
think about how people become

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who they are.

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Jane: And what did you find from
the families that you

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interviewed?

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Susan Dominus: Well, I think I
found often that the parents

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were the ones who were maybe
setting a tone in the family and

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setting--maybe they were
inspiring people themselves in

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some not necessarily famous way,
but a way that was really

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meaningful to the kids, you
know, maybe they had immigrated

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from afar, a country overseas,
and had built new lives so their

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kids could have better
opportunities, or maybe they had

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overcome racial stereotypes in
order to succeed, and at times

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where the world was not really
conspiring to help them do that,

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but the siblings, it turned out,
were often very helpful in

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giving logistical advice and
pointing them in the right

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directions. And older siblings
can really guide the way for

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younger siblings, because they
understand how the school works,

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they've looked at their friends
and seen what worked for them,

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and they can pass that
information down. And sometimes

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kids, especially teenagers,
would much rather have advice

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from a sibling, even a sibling
that they sometimes fight with,

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they'd still rather have that
advice come from a sibling than

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a parent, because teenagers
really don't like to do what

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their parents want them to do a
lot of the time.

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Jane: Research into siblings
backs up what Susan Dominus

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found in her reporting. Siblings
are family, but they're also

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kind of like a peer or friend
relationship. You learn how to

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get along with people by
learning how to get along with

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your sibling with the safety
that they'll always still be

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your sibling. But that doesn't
necessarily mean it's easy. We

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have a question from Julia.

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Julia: I am nine years old. I
live in Tarragona, Spain, and my

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question is, why do I fight with
my sister if I love her?

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Susan Dominus: I think that
sibling tensions are very, very

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natural. And, you know, I don't
know this is the kind of thing

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you can prove, but evolutionary
biologists would say it really

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all comes down to resources, or
a feeling of resources. It's

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hard to avoid the feeling that,
you know, love is a pie, and

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that the bigger your sister's
slice is, that means the smaller

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yours is. But one of my favorite
short story collections is

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called Love is Not a Pie,
meaning it doesn't deplete. You

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know, if you give some to one
person, it doesn't mean there's

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not enough for the other person.
And so I think part of getting

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older is realizing that there's
enough to go around. But I also

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think that siblings are trying
to differentiate from each

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other, and that also it's just
unfortunate for siblings that

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people tend to compare them, and
I think that puts people kids,

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especially in an uncomfortable
place sometimes.

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Jane: I love that. Susan
mentioned the short story, Love

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is Not a Pie. It's one of my
favorite short stories (written

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for adults), but also the
author, Amy Bloom, was on our

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show several years ago in an
episode called "How does it feel

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when your family changes?" You
might enjoy listening to that

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one. And research has shown that
having a younger sibling teaches

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older siblings things like
empathy--hat's the ability to

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understand how someone else
might be feeling--and to work on

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social skills like sharing and
playing.

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Coming up: if having siblings is
so great, why do they drive you

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nuts?

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BREAK: BREAK

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Nagore: This is But Why, from
Vermont Public. I'm Jane

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Lindholm. We're learning about
brothers and sisters and

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siblings. Today we're speaking
with Susan Dominus. She wrote a

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book about families where
multiple siblings did big things

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as teenagers and adults. She
wanted to know what was

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happening in those families that
led to the children becoming

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what are sometimes called high
achievers. The book is called

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The Family Dynamic. It's a book
written for adults, but Susan

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likes thinking about and talking
with kids, too, so she was

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excited to answer your
questions. Here's one we got

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from a lot of you.

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I'm Nagore. I'm 10 years old,
and I live in Colombia, close to

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Bogota. Why don't siblings get
along perfectly?

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Marin: Hi, my name is Marin. I'm
eight years old, and I live in

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Garrett, Indiana, and my
question is, why do siblings

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fight a lot?

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Phoebe: Hi, my name is Phoebe. I
live in Barbadoes. I am six

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years old. Why are little
sisters and brothers so

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annoying? And goodbye.

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Ruby: My name is Ruby. I'm seven
years old. I live in Fair Oaks,

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California. My question is, why
are brothers and sisters so

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annoying? [Annoying little
brother noises]

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Unknown: [Laughs] I think it is
a little bit of just a question

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of proximity. You know what I
mean? Even roommates who live

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together often, there are, you
know, they start to get on each

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other's nerves. There's just so
many little choices and tasks

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and interactions that happen
over the course of the day. I

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think, with siblings, it's even
more complicated, because your

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sibling is just enough like you,
maybe, that you think that you

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should get along perfectly, but
siblings actually are also just

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different enough that they're
going to have different points

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of view, different tastes,
different personalities. And I

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think that sometimes we feel
what's known as cognitive

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dissonance when we look at
someone and say, "You're my

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sibling, you might even look
like me. Why is it that you, of

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all people, don't see things the
way that I do?" And I think that

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can be really frustrating and
surprising to us, maybe.

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Jane: Your siblings are learning
to have a relationship with

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their peers through their
relationship with you and any

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other siblings. Often that means
testing out new strategies,

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whether they realize that's what
they're doing or not. So maybe

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they're making an annoying noise
and waiting to see your

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reaction. If you think it's
funny, maybe they'll try that

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noise with their friends. If you
think it's annoying, well, maybe

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they'll learn. Of course, it's
also totally possible they're

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just doing it to annoy you, and
if you show you're annoyed, they

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might do it again.

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Do sibling sibling relationships
and the effect of having a

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sibling tend to flow from the
oldest sibling down to the

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youngest? Does the oldest
sibling always set the tone or

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always create the conflict or
always create the support to

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help another sibling succeed? Or
can it be mixed, depending on,

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you know, where you fall in the
family?

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Unknown: Even at a young age, we
do know that there is something

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called a sibling spillover
effect, and what that finds is

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that when one sibling starts
doing better in school, the

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other siblings do as well, and
there's a kind of complicated

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way that they were able to
figure out that it's not because

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of how their parenting, you
know, has been changed, or

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because of some genetic overlap.
I won't bore you with the

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details, but scientists were
very clever about how to do a

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study that separated that out so
they can really see that no, no,

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it's the way that the sibling is
behaving that's changing the

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other sibling. And those effects
can actually work in both

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directions. They can go older to
younger, but also younger to

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older. I think even the older
you get, the less the age of the

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siblings matters. You know, when
everybody's out there in the

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world and they're doing their
own thing, that's when you

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really see, often, a kind of
network effect of siblings who

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are helping each other. Because,
you know, when you're 36 years

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old, it doesn't matter if your
32-year-old sister is the person

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who makes that introduction for
you or gives you advice.

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Jane: Does that work for things
like musical instruments and

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playing sports too, or just in
school?

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Unknown: There's not tons of
research about that, but I would

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assume it works for all kinds of
things. You know, there's like a

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fun fact: There are some
researchers who have been trying

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to make the case that younger
siblings are over-represented,

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actually, in sports, and that's
because of this idea of

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differentiation, because the
oldest sibling, for various

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reasons, maybe because the
parents put the most pressure on

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them, that's what some research
suggests, but the oldest

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siblings tend to be the most
academically strong, and so then

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younger siblings think, "Well,
I'm not going to be able to own

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that, so I'm going to instead
throw myself into sports." It's

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not like we think that they're
biologically more athletic for

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some reason. It just seems to be
a choice in how they invest

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their energy.

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Jane: Parents have an effect on
cognitive development--brain

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development--of their oldest
kids, because they often spend

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the most one on one time with
their eldest child. There are no

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other kids to compete for their
attention. But those benefits

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are then passed down to the
younger children by that eldest

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child, especially around
literacy, reading. Older

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siblings looking at books with
their younger siblings can help

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them learn to read. And the
eldest's own reading ability is

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improved by spending that time
reading with their younger

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siblings. But are there limits
to the sibling relationship?

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Akira: My name is Akira, and I'm
six years old, and I'm from

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Japan, and my question is, can
my sister be my best friend?

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Unknown: I mean, when that
works, it's the greatest thing

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ever. I can tell you that my
sister is probably my best

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friend. And we have...we are
really different. In fact, we

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look so different that when we
were little, somebody once put

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my sister in one room and me in
another room, and these kids

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grilled us on what our father's
middle name was and things like

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that, because they couldn't
believe we were sisters. And we

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have fought plenty over the
years. And I'll tell you a

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little secret: we still fight
sometimes. But she's also my

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best friend, and I feel so lucky
every day that she was the

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person plunked into my family
along with me. And, in fact, I

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even moved around the corner
from my sister when I was trying

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to figure out where to land with
my husband before we even had a

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family.

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Jane: Sibling dynamics tend to
change as kids get older, and

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the kids who are older start to
allow younger siblings more

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power in the relationship. That
shift can be messy, but it's

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important to developing the
relationship that will exist

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throughout your adulthood. In
Susan's book, she wrote about

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how siblings will often push
each other to be better people.

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They can compete with each other
and make each other better.

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Unknown: So for example, I wrote
about the Holifield family,

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which is a sibling of civil
rights activists who came out of

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Tallahassee, Florida at a time
when it was really hard to be a

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young Black person in this
country. You know, one of the

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siblings, when she was only 16
years old, decided that she was

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going to be one of the only
three kids who were Black who

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desegregated the biggest, best
high school in the capital of

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Florida, which was the last of
all of the states, apparently,

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to integrate.

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Jane: Integration was bringing
together Black and white

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students into the same schools.
This was happening in the 1950s

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and 1960s. Students were
educated separately before that

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because of racism and racist
laws.

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Unknown: And her older brother,
Bishop, said he looked at her

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and thought, "Wow, she's really
set the bar really high, and now

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I want to honor that and live up
to it." And when he got to law

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school at Harvard, he started
the Black Law Students

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Association, which was one of
the first kind of groups like

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that on any any law school. And
it was hugely influential. He

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helped bring the first Black law
professors to Harvard Law

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School. Then other schools
followed suit. And so there's

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all kinds of ways that siblings
can inspire each other and

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really go on to do great things.

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Susan, what if you don't have a
sibling?

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It's funny. I just had dinner
last night with a young woman

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who is an only child, and she
was telling me that she kind of

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instinctively became friendly
with lots of lots of young women

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her age, and almost would
describe many of those friends

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00:16:51,675 --> 00:16:54,660
like a sister. And I think, in
some ways, to have a friend

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who's like a sister, but with
all the baggage of actually

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being a sister, hey, that's
like, that's maybe even the best

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case scenario. There are really
special things about having a

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sibling, but there are also
really special things about

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being an only child and having
your parents' undivided

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attention and not ever being
compared to anybody else, not

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having to deal with the
day-to-day irritations of maybe

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sharing a room or sharing a
bathroom, waiting your turn. I

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think there are a lot of
tensions in life that are very

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painful, from which you're
really completely liberated.

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Jane: Whatever your relationship
with your siblings, or if you

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are the only child in your
family, your relationships with

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your family shape your future in
important ways. There's no wrong

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or right way to have a family.

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That's it for this episode. As
always, if you have a question

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about anything, have an adult
record you asking it on a

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00:17:46,950 --> 00:17:50,310
smartphone using an app like
Voice Memos. Then have your

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00:17:50,310 --> 00:17:54,810
adult email the file to
questions@butwhykids.org. Our

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00:17:54,810 --> 00:17:57,810
show is produced by Sarah Baik,
Melody Bodette and me, Jane

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00:17:57,810 --> 00:18:02,130
Lindholm, at Vermont Public and
distributed by PRX. Our video

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00:18:02,175 --> 00:18:05,055
producer is Joey Palumbo, and
our theme music is by Luke

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00:18:05,055 --> 00:18:08,355
Reynolds. If you like our show,
please have your adults help you

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00:18:08,355 --> 00:18:12,075
give us a thumbs up or a review
on whatever podcast platform you

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00:18:12,075 --> 00:18:15,495
use to listen to us. It helps
other kids and families find us.

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We'll be back in two weeks with
an all new episode. Until then,

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00:18:20,775 --> 00:18:22,215
stay curious!